Skip to content


Old NSA tapes discussed, US and Israel’s gov’t claims debunked.

The attack has never been investigated honestly to this day,,,why?

PLUS GOOGLE DOT COM — Comments/conversation between Liberty apologist Bennett Ruda and USS Liberty supporter Ken Halliwell re the NSA transcripts which were re-leased nine years ago.  More to come?https://plus.google.com/115919399429868244664/posts/1zMPrbth5bk

Bennett Ruda  -  Nov 23, 2011  -  Public

* USS Liberty tapes released by Israel’s Channel 2*
Elder of ZiyonIn addition to the newly released tapes, Elder of Ziyon also links to transcripts from the NSA website–posted in 2009–that prove the same thing.

USS Liberty tapes released by Israel’s Channel 2. From Egypt’s Al Masry al Youm: Forty-four years after Israeli pilots bombed the American ship USS Liberty during the 1967 War, an Israeli news…
 
 
Ken Halliwell  -  Nonsense. These transcripts are not new — they were released by NSA about 9 years ago. The transcripts contain voice communications between IDF helicopter pilots, their controller, and IDF torpedo boat pilots — all of which occurred shortly after the attack, not during the attack. The IDF’s investigation records are clear: the IAF fighter pilots willfully and repeatedly attacked an unidentified ship, and the torpedo boat pilots ignored orders to not attack. A clear case of gross negligence causing multiple homicides and personal injuries, for which nobody was punished; i.e., standand operating procedure for the IDF.

Nov 23, 2011  

 
Bennett Ruda's profile photo

Bennett Ruda  -  That is exactly what was written–”transcripts from the NSA website–posted in 2009.” That date may be when new material was uploaded.The scans of the transmissions that the blog includes, and which are accessible from the NSA website, do not support your interpretation of events.
Nov 23, 2011  

 
Ken Halliwell  -  Please see: http://www.nsa.gov/public_info/declass/uss_liberty/
There you will find the full version of the transcripts.
They contain no communications that occurred during the attack.
They contain only communications that occurred after the attack.

Nov 23, 2011  

 
Bennett Ruda's profile photo

Bennett Ruda  -  The point is the content of the communications at that time.
Nov 23, 2011  

 
Ken Halliwell's profile photo

Ken Halliwell  -  The content does not support claims presented by Channel 2. Content was taken out-of-context, assigned to events different than those represented in the content, and conclusions asserted thereupon. In short, Channel 2 ‘s presentation was a fraud.
Some actual key points in the communication transcript’s content:
- Ground controller for post-attack helicopters appears confused about ship’s nationality.
- Helicopter pilot sees and reports American flag on ship.
- Helicopter pilot asks torpedo boat pilot the meaning of “GTR5″ (ship’s ID number) on the ship’s bow. Torpedo boat pilot responds: “It means nothing.”None of this has anything to do with communications during the attack, between the attack-pilots and their ground controller.
Nov 23, 2011 (edited)  

 
Bennett Ruda's profile photo

Bennett Ruda  -  The first and last examples you cite seem to imply negligence and sloppiness, not premeditation.
Regarding the middle example–at what point does this happen and what is the response to that information?
Nov 23, 2011  

 
Ken Halliwell's profile photo

Ken Halliwell  -  Indeed, there is no direct evidence for premeditation, only gross negligence.
The helicopter pilot is asked to confirm that the ship’s flag is American a few minutes after he arrives at the ship’s location.
This occurs after both the air and sea attacks have completed.
You can read a point-by-point summary of attack events, as presented in Israeli investigation reports, here:
essay1 | usslibertyinquiry
Nov 24, 2011 (edited)  

 
Bennett Ruda's profile photo

Bennett Ruda  -  Fair enough. I have been addressing your initial comment:”The IDF’s investigation records are clear: the IAF fighter pilots willfullyand repeatedly attacked an unidentified ship”Now, as you agree, “there is no direct evidence for premeditation.”

What remains is to assess the degree of negligence/error.

Nov 23, 2011  

 
Ken Halliwell's profile photo

Ken Halliwell  -  I have never said that the attack was premeditated, but there is ample direct evidence for gross negligence.
There is no doubt that the pilots were willful. All Israeli reports are clear in stating that the ship was not identified before the air attack began. Yet, the attack-pilot’s air controller ordered them to attack an unidentified ship, and the pilots followed their orders; i.e., the pilots willfully attacked an unidentified ship.
Here are two essays that deal with this issue:
essay2 | usslibertyinquiry
essay28 | usslibertyinquiry
Nov 24, 2011  

 
Bennett Ruda's profile photo

Bennett Ruda  -  Wilfull means there was intent and that it was deliberate. I don’t want to demean the discussion by engaging in hairsplitting definitions.We see this disaster differently.
Nov 24, 2011  

 
Ken Halliwell's profile photo

Ken Halliwell  -  Exactly. With full intent, the pilots deliberately attacked an unidentified ship. This fact is undisputed and clearly stated in all Israeli investigation reports.For the air attack, it was not a case of mistaken identity, it was a case of failure to identify. Obviously, if the target had been identified, then it would not have been attacked. Attacking an unidentified ship is prima facie gross negligence.Clark Clifford said it best in his report to President L.B. Johnson: “The unprovoked attack on the Liberty constitutes a flagrant act of gross negligence for which the Israeli Government should be held completely responsible, and the Israeli military personnel involved should be punished.”

It’s not commonly known, but key IDF personnel were charged with gross negligence, but the IDF military judge hearing the matter concluded: “I have not discovered any deviation from the standard of reasonable conduct which would justify committal of anyone for trial.” In other words, it’s apparently standard operating procedure for the IDF to attack unidentified targets.

Nov 25, 2011 (edited)  

 

Bennett Ruda's profile photo

Bennett Ruda  -  Sarcasm aside, if true, the conclusion of the judge indicates that not all the facts are known.
 
from John Gidusko’s USS Liberty Newsletter #528  (11/25/11)
Bookmark and Share

Posted in Disinformation, General Discussion, John Gidusko USS Liberty Files, The dishonesty and comedy of A. Jay Cristol, USS Liberty Inquiry: An Evidentiary Study of the USS Liberty Attack.

Tagged with , , , , , , , , , , , , , .


0 Responses

Stay in touch with the conversation, subscribe to the RSS feed for comments on this post.

You must be logged in to post a comment.